General Category => Simplex Sportsman => Topic started by: Ricks on March 10, 2014, 07:05:35 AM
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As many on here know, I traded my 3 wheel Simplex Truck replica last year for a 1960 Sportsman. This is a relatively rare rear foot peg model. I have been told they are uncomfortable to ride, but we shall see. I have spent the last 6 months gathering parts for this build. I have now acquired most of the parts to put it together. I have posted a few things in some other threads about it, but to keep it together, I will repost some of the things here.
Here is how I got it. Dirty, put looking pretty decent.
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Down in my workshop. Much nicer to work in the basement during the cold winter than in the garage!
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Here is the engine torn down. Many things were wrong with it. See this thread for the gory details.
http://www.simplexservi-cycle.com/index.php?topic=749.0
I have not built the engine yet, as I am still on the lookout for a single spark plug cylinder for it. I do have a dual plug cylinder ready to go if that becomes the only thing holding up the project.
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It took a little while to figure out how the kick start return spring went on, especially since it was the wrong one! I bought a box full of springs from Glenn at Portland that came from the Wollard auction, and there was 2 new correct ones in the box! Talk about lucky!
I also got the brake rod worked out.
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Tires for these bikes are not the same as a standard simplex 2.50 x 26. They used a 3.00 x 27, which used a different diameter rim. Being as Coker doesn't make this size, I choose to go with a 3.00 x 21 motorcycle tire. These are close to the correct rim size, and I have seen an article where these were used with success. Being that the only tread pattern I could get for these was for a trials bike, they are very aggressive. If I was going to order another pair, I would choose to get 2.75 x 21, as the slightly smaller size would leave a little more frame clearance.
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As it sits now. I'm digging the riser handlebars! I assembled the throttle and grips. Only 4 months to go before Portland.
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That is looking great so far and yes you will like the higher handlebars. Makes it fell a little more like right. I just wished I had a true set of sportman handlebars for mine. Theres something about the clean look that catches your eye. ;D
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Rick, you will be leaning back and I will be leaning forward!
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Looks great Rick. Is that tank freshly painted, or were you able to get that shine from buffing it?
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That's the paint that was on it when I got it. I just buffed it out. It is an ok paint job. I may repaint it in the future.
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I'm not a fan of the hi rise handlebars. With the style of these bikes I think the standard style looks better.
I wonder how many Sportsmen have showed up at Portland over the years?
Mike Sal
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In my opinion, it's would be hard to improve on the old original style handlebars. They seem to fit perfect with the era and classic style of the Servi Cycle.
Will
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I was re-reading the Wollard Simplex book & am a little surprised on how general it was in terms of actual facts & dates (just goes to show how much more research has been collected via the internet over the years since he wrote the book). He even states he hadn't even seen a Sportsman in real life & he was the self proclaimed king of Simplex at that time.
Mike Sal
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I was re-reading the Wollard Simplex book & am a little surprised on how general it was in terms of actual facts & dates (just goes to show how much more research has been collected via the internet over the years since he wrote the book). He even states he hadn't even seen a Sportsman in real life & he was the self proclaimed king of Simplex at that time.
Mike Sal
Mike, where did you read that? On page 30, he wrote he had never seen a SportSTER, not SportsMan. If you get out the magnifying glass and look at the 2 picture on the right side of the page, the tank decal on the lower picture reads Sportster, where as the top one reads Sportsman.
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Rick I got a good chuckle from my goof.....I was reading that last night while I was getting bleary eyed right before going to bed.....I guess I wasn't too alert!!! Thanks for straightening me out.
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Here are the tank decals that Sonrisers made for me. They are made out of the high quality car wrap vinyl. Thanks James!
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Is the blue decal?
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Is the blue decal?
Everything but the black is the decal.
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That stands out , real nice .
I like it .
Pete . :)
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Its nice..I just talked to James
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Looks good Rick, how did the install go? Are you happy with the colors and thickness. Looks good from the pics, how do you think they compares to the decals you got from Wayne?
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Looks great!
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Looks good Rick, how did the install go? Are you happy with the colors and thickness. Looks good from the pics, how do you think they compares to the decals you got from Wayne?
I did one side this morning. It took about 45 minutes. I had it about 90% on, and decided to move it a little to the front and down. I used a heat gun to soften it a bit and it went on pretty smoothly. It was easier to work the vinyl when it was a little warm. I will get to the other side in the next couple of days.
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I finally got the sportsman out of the basement and into the garage! I am going to try to get the engine put together in the next week or so. Hopefully I have everything for it. Here is what she looks like now.
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Looks great so far, kinda has that bultaco look with those tires.
But on a sidebar, I'm going to ask like everyone likes doing. Is that a motorized Coke box or just a iced box sitting there? ???
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It was a motorized cooler at one time, but somebody stripped it long before we got it. It actually belongs to my son, he collects some coke stuff. One day we are going to restore it.
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Yea Rick I've heard that line before, some twenty years ago when I hauled my Coke ice box out of the woods to be restored. Still needs to be restored and being used as a plant stand by the Wife. One day it will be done by who I dont know. Lol ::)
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Started putting the motor together today. I installed new bearings, ported the crank, and assembled the lower end. I checked piston clearance, and it hit the top of the head. The previous builder decked the case to increase the compression ratio. To overcome this, I took a little off the head of the new piston. I need to get some hardware, and I will install the piston and cylinder, but first I will clean up the exhaust ports and transfer ports. Always looking for a little extra horsepower!
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Ha . Maybe you'll get it up to 41 MPH , Rick . ;)
Pete . :)
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Someone posted a pic on my Facebook simplex page...looks like you had this at Portland? Looks great
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Someone posted a pic on my Facebook simplex page...looks like you had this at Portland? Looks great
Yes, unfortunately it is not yet running. I had a problem with the crankshaft and Wayne is making me a new one.
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Wasn't that suppose to have been done already , Rick ?
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Wasn't that suppose to have been done already , Rick ?
Wayne's machinist had a bicycle accident and broke his collar bone. He just got back to work and hopefully he can get the crank made soon.
Pete, get to Portland next year and you can ride it!
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That's almost sounds like a bribe , Rick . :D
I'm planning on being there next year even if your Sportsman isn't done .
I have to dig my bike out of storage . I've been designing a few changes and need the bike at hand for final measurements / fittings and such .
I really miss having a shop for my tinkering . :(
Pete . :)
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Has Lunati completed your 5-axis cnc'd crank yet!? LoL
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I spoke with Wayne last week and he assured me we are getting close. I would really like to ride it before the snow comes along!
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I know it's been 2 months since I have updated this thread, but I spoke with Wayne this morning and my crank is finally done!! I will post a picture when it gets here, so you can see how he attaches a new shaft to an original counterweight. With a little luck, I should have this running in a couple of weeks.
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'so you can see how he attaches a new shaft to an original counterweight.'
That ^ should be interesting . I'll just guess he used super glue . ;)
How long did that new crank take to build or rebuild ?
Pete . :)
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I ordered it in July. His machinist had an accident, and was out of work for a long while. When he got back to work, this was not a top priority job. Wayne had a run of regular cranks made, as well as a few sportsman cranks, so if anyone needs one, they are now in stock.
Years ago, Wayne had some billet cranks made, but they were expensive. He had been putting new shafts into original counterweights for several years now with good results. I believe the process he uses is furnace brazing to make the connection.
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I can only imagine the cost of those billet cranks ... But , you'd never have to worry about them coming out of balance . I suppose there shouldn't be much concern about his brazed cranks ever loosing balance either ( as long as the brazing holds , anyway ) .
Not to jack your thread , Rick , but the subject of crank weight to ease vibration and improve efficiency popped into mind . I know some have toyed with that , but I don't recall what the final result was , if any . Or is that something that is still 'in the lab' ?
Pete . :)
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Should be interesting.
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I can only imagine the cost of those billet cranks ... But , you'd never have to worry about them coming out of balance . I suppose there shouldn't be much concern about his brazed cranks ever loosing balance either ( as long as the brazing holds , anyway ) .
Not to jack your thread , Rick , but the subject of crank weight to ease vibration and improve efficiency popped into mind . I know some have toyed with that , but I don't recall what the final result was , if any . Or is that something that is still 'in the lab' ?
Pete . :)
Simplex kept adding weight to their cranks up until the end of production, so I would say it worked. Norm Burton was of the opinion that more counterweight would be good, and Gary Wollard and him did this on several cranks. What the end result of their work was, I don't know. For those that don't know, Norm wrote the engine section of Gary's book.
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Good to know . It would be nice to have documentation of their work .
I'm guessing that the cranks that Wayne rebuilds have no added weight other than what brazing might add .
I have to wonder just how much weight the factory added over the years . Does anyone happen to have that information ?
Pete . :)
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Finally got the crank. The first couple of pictures are a reminder of what it looked like, and the next are after Wayne made a new shaft and attached it to the old counterweight.
I will clean the port up with a sanding roll before assembly to clean up a few rough edges.
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glad you got it back Rick.
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Rick ,
You must be real excited ... hands still shaky ? LOL
Glad you finally have it .
Pete . :)
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Rick ,
You must be real excited ... hands still shaky ? LOL
Glad you finally have it .
Pete . :)
Now I need to find the time to put it back together. I rode my other Simplex's yesterday, but it was cold.
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It's Alive! Got it running today and took it out for a couple of test rides. The clutch makes a lot of noise until it is engaged, not sure why? I disconnected the drive belts and the engine runs smooth as silk!
Maybe it has something to do with a modification done by a previous owner. For some reason, someone cut grooves into the clutch weights, maybe to lighten them for quicker engagement? I will look into it over the winter, but if anyone has any ideas, feel free to share them.
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Good to hear . I knew it wouldn't take you too long .
Which way do the grooves run , Rick ?
Across , with or diagonally the weight length ?
I have cut grooves in brake shoes ( diagonally ) to aid in clean out ...
Pete . :)
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Pete, they cut the grooves out with a lathe. Maybe they are too light and are rattling around.
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Check the slots of the weight guides for wear at the bottom ( as opposed to the tips ).
That might allow the weights to stay away from the sliding member of the driven pulley and rattle some .
Mine had slight wear there and wouldn't allow free outward movement from the very bottom of the slot . The weights would move outward after enough RPMs would force them out . They had to be forced over the hump of the wear spot and then they moved freely . While in the bottom / wear spot the weights had room to move around without being forced against the sliding member .
Hopefully I explained that well enough ?
Pete . :)
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Obviously the bikes defective and these guys won't tell you....better send it to me...I'm harder to aggravate and might not notice.
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What no pictures? Come on now the first ride and nothing to show for it. :o
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What no pictures? Come on now the first ride and nothing to show for it. :o
Pictures to follow! I had to go to that awful place called work!
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Took a quick look at the tracks this morning as suggested by Pete. They are perfect. I think what someone did in the past, besides cutting the grooves in the weights to lighten them, they also cut down the outside diameter. This makes them move out very quickly, and causes the clutch to engage at a lower rpm. The downside to this, there is a lot of room for the weights to rattle. On my other double track clutch, there is no play at rest, the weights are firmly against the movable pulley.
Does anyone have a clutch off a bike that they can measure the outside diameter of the weight for me? I don't really want to dismantle my other bike to measure it.
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Rick ,
It might be interesting to know exactly how much weight difference between your modified weights and OEM originals .
What you are saying about your possibly 'trimmed' weights does make sense .
Pete . :)
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I am assuming you have the barbell style weights Rick.
I measured one and it is exactly11/16th of an inch in diameter.
I'll poet a pic as soon as the email I sent from my phone to myself arrives and I resize the pic.
Huston
hgonthehd
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I am assuming you have the barbell style weights Rick.
I measured one and it is exactly11/16th of an inch in diameter.
I'll poet a pic as soon as the email I sent from my phone to myself arrives and I resize the pic.
Huston
hgonthehd
Thanks Huston. I thought the early style were called the barbell. The late style just look like a piece of bar stock.
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You're probably right. I've read all I can find and have accumulated quite a few parts but the only transmissions I have other than manual ones are the ones with the barbell style weights.
I'll see if BJM or his son has one we can measure early next week if you don't get an answer before then.
Attached is the picture of the weight I measured.
Huston
hgonthehd
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The barbell fits in the single track clutch, which was used until late 1954 or early 1955. The double track clutch replaced it, and was, in the opinion of many, not as good as the single track, but was cheaper to make. Thanks!
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Here is the bike, mostly complete. I need an original air filter, which I might never find. I do have a regular Simplex air filter to put on it for now. I will order a couple of clutch weights from Wayne and see if that takes care of the rattle.
I would really like to find a more original tire for the bike, as these are really too big and don't allow the bike to sit on the center stand properly. I do have one original tire, a little worn, but usable if I can find another.
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Nice , so far , Rick .
" The double track clutch replaced it, and was, in the opinion of many, not as good as the single track, but was cheaper to make. "
What makes the single track better ?
Pete . :)
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Pete, they engage smoother and are quieter.
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That begs the question 'why?'
Are the guides / tracks a different angle or radius ? I see they are heavier / thicker on the single track .
Are the throw-out weights different weight , totally ?
Is the sliding member of the driven pulley a different configuration ? I can't tell from the manual .
Pete . :)
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That begs the question 'why?'
Are the guides / tracks a different angle or radius ? I see they are heavier / thicker on the single track .
Are the throw-out weights different weight , totally ?
Is the sliding member of the driven pulley a different configuration ? I can't tell from the manual .
Pete . :)
I think it is because the weight shaft and the weights can rotate independently. Less friction when they move up and down the track and against the moveable pulley.
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Am I mistaken , thinking that the single track clutch has four ( 4 ) governors / weights ?
Not sure I'd go along with the less friction part .
Seems to me that the independent single track weights would have twice as much opportunity to add friction being as the weights could touch the tracks from either side , not to mention double ( or there about ) contact surface of the shaft to the track .
And , theoretically , the weights should be moving at the same rate / time if they and the tracks are identical .
I don't know how the single and double track governors compare for total contact surface to the sliding member of the driven pulley .
Maybe the heavier / thicker single track governor track being wider provides a smoother transition of weight / governor and the 'fingers' , having more mass , absorb more vibration ( = sound ) .
Pete . :)
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The single track has 2 weights that look like barbells. The reason for less friction, as I see it, is the center bar rotates free of the weights, so they roll independently. With the twin track clutch, the weights are solid, and can bind up between the two tracks.
But, I may be wrong! lol
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2 weights does change things considerably ...
That would half the amount of friction and noise I imagined with 4 weights .
I have to wonder how much weight difference , if any , between the single and double track governors / weights .
I'd like to have a single track in hand for comparison to my double track .
Pete . :)
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Ok now a picture of you flying bye.
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Looks good Rick. Glad to hear its up and running. Dave