Author Topic: Simplex 5 speed build  (Read 207604 times)

ndian22

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #360 on: February 21, 2017, 03:11:38 PM »
Well guys color me surprised. The motor that ran on the bench just weeks ago is seized. First thought it was the kick lever mech but soon saw it was not at fault. I rotated the kick lever after the last test run to see if everything cleared when it was placed back in the bike frame, so it was free up to that point. I'm hoping it's moisture, if so it might not be as big a deal as it first appeared, that starter assembly is a real bear to replace and requires splitting the cases...major job.
I've filled the cylinder with Marvel. Mysyery oil and diesel that with patience and a bit of jiggling back and forth should free things up. I hope. Things don't always go perfectly and at least I'm still having fun.  Rick C.

pd

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #361 on: February 22, 2017, 06:40:10 AM »
" I'm still having fun.  Rick C. "

That's the key . ;)

Good luck .

Pete . :)
Goes around , Comes around . :)

ndian22

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #362 on: February 22, 2017, 06:59:03 AM »
Hi Pete, I woke up this morning quite early and went straight to it. I put the bike in fifth gear and rocked it back and forth maybe a dozen time with the plug out and felt it move a bit and kept at it gentle bumps and in less than five minutes the internals were rotating freely, found neutral and the kick lever could easily turn it over with the plug in or out. Though not complete and running I'm a happy camper. I'll drain, clean the filter and refill before trying a restart. I'll then circulate the oil for a brief time and again drain and this time clean out both filters and refill. I don't anticipate much debris because it broke free so easily and quickly, but I'll watch and listen for tell tale signs that all is well or not for awhile.

I don't have a clue as to why but suspect condensate moisture from the fuel can perhaps?? Rick C. 

pd

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #363 on: February 22, 2017, 07:38:53 AM »
"I don't have a clue as to why but suspect condensate moisture from the fuel can perhaps?? Rick C. "

That was my thought , too . But ???

Hopefully the 'oils' you soaked with will coat things enough until you get to the running stage .

Pete . :)
Goes around , Comes around . :)

carryall

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #364 on: February 22, 2017, 12:24:56 PM »
Hmm?  I've never heard/seen rings seize in that short of time on a engine.  Especially one that was recently run, let alone so new?  There would have to have been ALOT of water in the fuel system, and if so, how did it run? Could it have been the clutch plates seized?  Just to be safe, I'd drain the oil and open up the oil filter looking for metal and maybe drop the oil pan and inspect there for pieces also. 

ndian22

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #365 on: February 22, 2017, 04:45:06 PM »
Neither have I. I drained the oil it was shipped, a few weeks later refilled, started a run in for 15 or 20 minutes on the bench, drained and cleaned both filters. Refilled with mineral oil and it set in the frame cradle for a couple of months and 3 or 4 weeks ago I gave it a short run in the frame, no load,  and finally a few days ago went to start and it was locked up. No sign of water "milk" or contamination in any of the changes and only a very small bit of aluminum in the filters. I actually was seeing about the same as when I broke in the same model engine on the Simplex. Clutch plates sticking is a good go to alternative, but the only area I addressed was the jug, but the rocking in gear might just as well have freed a seized clutch.

The clutch side engine cover has to be dropped to service the second oil filter and that area didn't reveal any debris, no pan on this models so splitting the cases is the only way to get a look in the crankcase. I will do another oil change after I get it running for thirty minutes or so to check for signs of damage in the filters and oil.

The motor ran well on both of the two test start ups...once it started, took a bit of cranking the first time not so much on the second. I drained the oil again today & it looked fine as did the filters,so I refilled and got it stated once again and ran for a couple of minutes and it died, I tried to restart and no good then noticed there was no fuel in the clear line or the transparent filter. I worked with it awhile took the vented cap off the tank, and ran new line and new filter, petcock also functioned perfectly & had copious fuel flow to the carb, but attach it to the carb and all flow stopped. It's a new Japanese built Mikuni round slide, but may have set up with fuel as I don't recall draining it after the second test run.

I'll get to it tomorrow though suggestions are appreciated.  Rick C.

carryall

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #366 on: February 22, 2017, 05:21:37 PM »
stuck float needle maybe?  Give it a gentle tap?

pd

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #367 on: February 23, 2017, 05:49:08 AM »
Maybe even a robust 'tap' . A couple , done with authority . Stuck needles happens a fair amount on the Honda in line fours and we suggest rapping the bowls with a screwdriver handle butt . Usually does the trick .

Pete . :)
Goes around , Comes around . :)

ndian22

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #368 on: February 23, 2017, 07:58:04 AM »
I will do so, again, but this time with more enthusiasm...expecting a harmonious outcome. I really should have drained the carb as varnish can form quite quickly. If the float doesn't respond. I will partially disassemble and soak in carb cleaner for a couple of days. Full disassembly isn't a problem though I'd prefer having a rebuild kit on hand; if for no other reason to have fresh O rings for reassembly. Rick C.

pd

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #369 on: February 23, 2017, 09:26:04 AM »
That yellowish leftover from what they are selling us as gasoline can clog things nicely .

If you use carb cleaner , be sure to remove all rubber or anything resembling it before soaking the carb body . Carb cleaner eats rubber and such .

Pete . :)
Goes around , Comes around . :)

carryall

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #370 on: February 23, 2017, 09:50:50 AM »
Amen to that!

ndian22

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #371 on: February 23, 2017, 10:22:13 AM »
I don't use commercial cleaners for that reason. I find a mixture of kerosine and Marvel Mystery oil works well if one is willing to wait a couple of days to see some results and doesn't interact with the elastic.  Rick C.

ndian22

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #372 on: February 23, 2017, 05:16:45 PM »
My Mystery mix soaked the carb buggers away and I put about 45 minutes on the motor today in 3 sessions... starts pretty good and idles smooth but I'm geeting backfire from the exhaust now on quick applications of throttle...something new and I'll work on tomorrow. Rick C.

ndian22

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #373 on: February 23, 2017, 07:28:25 PM »
Exhaust is probably sucking air at the gasket or a valve stem seal. I'll check my work first at the manifold, copper gasket connection first and hope it's my bad crafting and or installation effort. Rick C.

carryall

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Re: Simplex 5 speed build
« Reply #374 on: February 24, 2017, 07:00:15 AM »
Another possibility is a hole plugged on the venture tube, or a jet.  Could make it lean momentarily at WOT.