Bolt in replacement wheels?

[Eitek1]

Does anyone have a picture of this nut that I could take a look at? I looked around online and saw a couple of different variations that I can only imagine aren't original.

I think if I had it to do all over again, I'd call Worksman and order the hub, brake, spokes and rim separate and without bearings and axles. I'm going to tear it all down for painting anyway and that way I wouldn't pay for parts that I didn't need and the effort to tear it down.

Tom, once I see a pic I'm going to look around and see if I can find something similar. If not, I think that a custom cut nut might be the ticket.

As a side note, I went back through the Wheels & Tires forum and saw something pretty interesting. In the thread about "Rear sealed bearing converstion" by illMATTIc http://www.simplexservi-cycle.com/index.php?topic=603.0 He talks about adding a sealed bearing to the original simplex rear hub. He said he put a 1-1/8 bearing with a 1/16 shim on the OD. That is effectively the same thing I was going to have to do. The ID of the bearing slot for the worksman wheel is 1 3/16 or 30mm.

The possibility may exist that the bearing that I ordered will fit in an original simplex hub and the same axle I ordered may work too... if there is a proper nut to fit it.

[Ricks]

Did you really want to see my nuts?

Ok, you asked for it.  LOL

These are later style acorn nuts.  Earlier used the same step but with an open nut.

[Eitek1]

Rick, thanks for the pic of your nuts. Honestly, I never really thought I'd be asking a man for a picture of his nuts but your nuts are vintage, are of great interest and are a sight to behold. 

I see what you are talking about as far as a stepped nut. I admit, I was a little confused as to what exactly that meant. After looking at it I'll say I'm still a bit curious. I'm wondering what kind of mechanical advantage was gained by the short collar on the wheel side of the nut.

It looks like the advantage would be that the rocker rides on the nut itself instead of the axle. I know there was a reason to make that special nut as opposed to using a regular nut but mentally I'm having trouble visualizing what that is. I guess if I saw how it all fit together originally it would make more sense. I won't have that luxury for another week or so.

You mentioned the locking nature of the nut. Could you explain that in more detail? Also, sorry if these are moronic questions but I have an insatiable need to understand these kind of things at a pretty basic level.

[Ricks]

A picture, or three, is worth a thousand words.

Ask all the questions you want, that is why we started this forum.  Soon, you will have all the answers!  Lol

If the nuts loosen slightly, there is no chance of the wheel falling out.  Pretty slick, if you ask me.

BTW, if you still have that 1948 air breather,  I know a really good machinist that will solve your problem in a trade!  Shameless plug for KartJockey

[Eitek1]

Ok... Now I think I understand. Also, it answers a few other questions I had.

Question 1.

Why on earth is the opening to the rocker on the front for smaller than the  opening that the axle fits in.

Answer - The axle nut has a shoulder/sleeve on it that fits between the axle and the rocker when tightened. The diameter of the sleeve on that fits into the rocker is larger than the diameter of the opening to the rocker. That means if the bolt comes loose the wheel will stay secured to the front rocker because the sleeve is larger than the hole the axle has to pass through. As long as the bolt is partially regardless of how loose the wheel will stay on the front forks.

I worked in a place quite a few years back that was built in 1917. They still had a lot of the old equipment and some of it was still used. I was perpetually in awe of some of the clever simple things that were done to make the equipment better. It's really pretty simple to over engineer something. You see it pretty much everywhere you look. To accomplish the same thing in a very simple way in many cases makes it a work of art.

[Eitek1]

Hmmmmmm.......

[pd]

Lug nuts ... Do those have the matching thread pitch to your axles ?

Pete .

[Eitek1]

I think they actually might. It's a lug nut off of a Toyota. This is almost becoming amusing.  Bearings probably from China, Axles from a slovik mini bike and lug nuts off of a toyota might be the answer to the Worksman wheel question.

Not sure how many 11mm pitches they have because I live in the world that is good and right and uses fractions. If there is only 1 size 11mm pitch then they will work. I'm pretty sure the step is too thick for the inside of the rocker.

[Eitek1]

I got the bearings and axles in. I didn't tear apart the worksman wheels as soon as I got them. The axle is kind of interesting. It's actually 1/2 between the bearings. The 1/2 in shoulder is what the inner race of the bearings are compressed against when every thing is tightened up. This keeps the compression loads from securing the wheel from affecting the performance of the bearings.

I'm going to have to cut a spacer to make up that piece with the axles I bought. I bought a pipe nipple that fits perfect if you file out the seam on the inside of the pipe. I've been a little ill today so I didn't get to finish it.

Honestly to do this right, you'd need to cut a new axle and use the bearings listed on the last page that I ordered. If you did that you could make it exactly like a simplex axle where it mattered and use the standard nuts. With the axle and bearings this would be a slam dunk and would make fitting this wheel to a simplex effortless. I'm going to draw up what it should look like and try to get one made.

Does anyone have a picture of a front and rear simplex axle they could post with measurements?  I want to make sure what I draw ends up being what will work.

[Ricks]

Here is a pair of Wayne's replacement axles.  He only makes them in 1 length, 5 9/16".  That is a stock simplex front axle length.  A stock simplex rear is 6".  Wayne says you do not need the extra length for the rear, and as I have used his replacements before, he is somewhat correct. I would rather a little longer for more engagement of the threads.  

[Eitek1]

Thanks, I guess that makes it easier.  I'm confused about something though. I just measured my frame and from inside to inside on the rear dropouts I measured 6 inches. Is my frame spread or do the stepped nuts make up the difference?

As a side note the smaller axle that I ordered will actually work fine with a spacer between the bearings. If you ever pulled the axle out you'd probably have to pull the bearings out and line everything up to install it. It'd be a pain. 

[Ricks]

Thanks, I guess that makes it easier.  I'm confused about something though. I just measured my frame and from inside to inside on the rear dropouts I measured 6 inches. Is my frame spread or do the stepped nuts make up the difference?

As a side note the smaller axle that I ordered will actually work fine with a spacer between the bearings. If you ever pulled the axle out you'd probably have to pull the bearings out and line everything up to install it. It'd be a pain. 

The space between the rear dropouts should be 4 3/4-5".  Someone definitely spread your frame.  It will probably be easy to squeeze it back together.

Using a spacer between the bearings is common.  On a Simplex Automatic transmission, there is such a spacer between the bearings.  When you install the bearings, put in the first side, add the spacer, then install the second side, but don't seat it all the way. Use a small rod to line up the spacer and then drive the second bearing in the rest of the way. The spacer will stay in place by friction until you get the axle installed.

[Eitek1]

Unless my measurements are off this is the axle dimensions required to use a Worksman 77A wheel on a simplex with minimum modifications. All you need is this axle and a set of bearings, which can be ordered and are readily available. This modification will use the standard simplex front nuts to secure the wheel to the forks.



I haven't had it machined yet but I plan to. Also the program I used didn't have the 7/16 BSC thread in it's database so they aren't shown.  Once I have one made I'll let y'all know how it works.

[kartjockey]

And be sure not to forget.....Oil bath breather for services rendered!  Will supply whatever you need including material etc.  I can make the correct nuts to lock into the drop-outs and whatever else it is you need along the way.

[Eitek1]

I talked to my buddy with the 3d printer and I found a guy with a scanner. Ill see what it will take to print one and see if you like it. My buddy said he would print them to sell if there was a market and he could make a few dollars. We can see if it's worth it...